Second Worst Man

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At yesterday's launch of "The Mistress and the Muse", a Manhattan retrospective of Norman Mailer's film work, the legendary author spoke about the second worst man he'd ever met, and The Reeler's Stu Van Airsdale wrote it all down:

"I sat across the table from him. He had about the stature of a man who's a publicity director for a Midwest corporation of medium size. There were about 12 of us at the table. I never met his eyes once even though I was sitting this far away from him. [Holds palms three feet apart.] I realized that this was a man who had learned very early in life to never have a conversation with anyone who could do you no good. So our eyes never met, because he sensed that if our eyes met, a good question would pop into my head.

"Anyway, that person -- number two -- is Ronald Reagan."

I don't like to visit much less dwell in this realm, but this led me to wonder who are the two or three worst people in Hollywood I've ever run across? And how do you define worst? For me it means a person who, after all is said and done, has shown himself to be profoundly vicious and ungracious in his regard for certain others, and who insists on a certain manic rigidity in his/her estimation of other people, places, views, etc. A person, in other words, who not only has a difficult time cut- ting other people slack, but who seems to revel -- who seems to almost derive a form of sensual pleasure -- in the caverns of sulfur, in harshness and combative- ness, in bully-boy scheming and finger-pointing and the rendering of damning judgments.

I was about to spit out the name of this rancid human being...until I stepped back and asked myself if I've been a little bit guilty of these things from time to time. I've been accused of being mean and overly judgmental, and I won't say I've never gone there. But I think I'm pretty good at cutting other people slack, which is to say choosing to focus on their good sides and ignore the bad. So I'm not going to spit that name out. But as God is my co-pilot and Jesus my judge, there are people in this town who in serious need of personality transplants.

Another yay for "Ultimatum"<< previous | next >>Hungarian translation

Posted by Jeffrey Wells on July 23, 2007 at 8:16 AM

comment #1

MickTravis says ...

That same sentiment about Reagan is also voiced by Norman during the "American Masters" documentary on Mailer. If you're interested in the guy and haven't seen that, it's pretty goddamned essential viewing, yo.

Posted by MickTravis at July 23, 2007 9:21 AM

comment #2

le corbeau says ...

Reagan was fairly deaf and ill at ease in many social conversations situations as a result. Especially given that they often involved somebody ranting at him about how evil he was.

Was the worst person he ever met FDR, for failing to get up and walk over to shake his hand?

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 9:22 AM

comment #3

Ian Sinclair says ...

My own #1 is Scott Rudin.

Posted by Ian Sinclair at July 23, 2007 10:01 AM

comment #4

Dan Revill says ...

"I've been accused of being mean and overly judgmental, and I won't say I've never gone there. But I think I'm pretty good at cutting other people slack, which is to say choosing to focus on their good sides and ignore the bad. So I'm not going to spit that name out."

To quote one of my faves, "Get off the cross, we could use the wood."

Posted by Dan Revill at July 23, 2007 10:18 AM

comment #5

MickTravis says ...

Yeah, that Reagan was a real wallflower, kind of shy, not good in conversation.

Posted by MickTravis at July 23, 2007 10:18 AM

comment #6

gruver1 says ...

Wells to Ian Sinclair: Scott Rudin is known for being a generator of tempest, depending on the issue and the alertness and sophistication levels of the former assistant spreading stories about him. Tempest usually boils down to things like obsessive exactitude, vocal volume, an inability to suffer fools, etc. These are relatively minor failings. The film industry would be a much blander, less interesting place without Rudin. A guy who cares about quality as much as he does deserves to be cut a little slack.

Posted by gruver1 at July 23, 2007 10:23 AM

comment #7

gruver1 says ...

Wells to Aladdin Sane: Get off the cross? Let's start over again and take it step by step. Mailer slams Reagan for being one of the worst men he's ever met. I wonder about the same in my Hollywood realm. I describe the qualities that would earn a person this distinction. I then admit to being guilty myself of two of these qualities. I therefore decline to name the person I had in mind. Where's the wood in this? The lesson I tried to invoke was "judge not less ye be judged."

Posted by gruver1 at July 23, 2007 10:27 AM

comment #8

Ian Sinclair says ...

Fine. You take him to the prom, then.

Posted by Ian Sinclair at July 23, 2007 10:30 AM

comment #9

MickTravis says ...

Ian, Scott Rudin made you take him to the prom? No wonder you hate him. Can we see the pictures, though?

Posted by MickTravis at July 23, 2007 10:36 AM

comment #10

Dan Revill says ...

Wells, you're constantly judgmental. You trying to deflect your own coming criticism is more to the point that you know you're a dick.
Your whole, "I'm not gonna do it now" is so unlike you (or at least the you presented here). Now you want us to notice it? Please.
Just be a dick. It's what you're good at.

Posted by Dan Revill at July 23, 2007 10:40 AM

comment #11

OddDuck says ...

Hey Aladdin, I don't know about dicks, but in this instance you're acting like a douche.

Posted by OddDuck at July 23, 2007 10:47 AM

comment #12

MathewM says ...

Norman Mailer is hardly a good judge of personality:

"Norman Mailer was criticised for his role in getting Jack Abbott released and was accused of being so blinded by Abbott's evident writing talent that he did not take into account Abbott's propensity for violence. In a 1992 interview in The Buffalo News, Mailer said that his involvement with Abbott was "another episode in my life in which I can find nothing to cheer about or nothing to take pride in.""

Posted by MathewM at July 23, 2007 11:11 AM

comment #13

Walter Sobchak says ...

Hmm. Mailer dissed Ronnie at a Manhattan book launch party.

Well, you gotta give him credit for wandering into the lion's den and not bowing to that obviously hostile, right-wing crowd.

(one imagines droll chortling from the likes of Dowd, Moyers, Frank Rich et al. as they clank their champagne glasses and applaud each other for being so bright, literate and not-common)

Posted by Walter Sobchak at July 23, 2007 11:32 AM

comment #14

le corbeau says ...

Hey, MathewM, Mailer left open the possibility that he considers Jack Henry Abbott worse.

I'm still not sure who's supposed to come off worse in the anecdote, by the way-- Reagan that he blew Mailer off, or Mailer that he expected that being asked about geopolitics was merely his due.

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 12:12 PM

comment #15

T. S. Idiot says ...

At least Norm didn't bite Dutch on the ear.

Posted by T. S. Idiot at July 23, 2007 12:16 PM

comment #16

MilkMan says ...

Ronald Reagan was a robot.
Norman Mailer is a pretentious twat who had a particular talent for making a spectacle of himself. Watch Maidstone if you want to know who Mailer thought he was, which is at odds with who he actually was, a self-serving hedonist whose fear of getting old and irrelevant manifested itself in an insatiable desire to be "hip" and "with-it." And for those of you who point to the relevancy of Executioner's Song, remember that Mailer did not work alone on that one; Lawrence Schiller did ALL the research and legwork.
Norman Mailer is also responsible for the death of a aspiring playwright vis a vis his role in the release of JH Abbott. How you feel about that depends on how you feel about aspiring NYC playwrights.
You know who else is a pretentious twat? Me. So take my word for it.

Posted by MilkMan at July 23, 2007 12:38 PM

comment #17

Hickenlooper says ...

Wow.

Posted by Hickenlooper at July 23, 2007 1:23 PM

comment #18

BurmaShave says ...

What a fucking asshole, Mailer. Ronald Reagan is really the devil to you people, and why? Ronald Fucking Reagan? B movie star, kind old man, "didn't care about AIDs" I guess, but then nobody did. Really, grow up.

Posted by BurmaShave at July 23, 2007 1:45 PM

comment #19

christian says ...

"A tree's a tree. How many more do you need to look at?"

--Ronald Reagan (Governor of California), The Sacramento Bee, opposing expansion of Redwood National Park, March 3, 1966

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 1:47 PM

comment #20

christian says ...

"Fascism was really the basis for the New Deal."
--Ronald Reagan, Time magazine, May 17, 1976

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 1:51 PM

comment #21

christian says ...

"Because Vietnam was not a declared war, the veterans are not even eligible for the G. I. Bill of Rights with respect to education or anything."

--Ronald Reagan, Newsweek, April 21, 1980.

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 1:54 PM

comment #22

BurmaShave says ...

"General Secretary Gorbachev, if you seek peace, if you seek prosperity for the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe, if you seek liberalization: Come here to this gate. Mr. Gorbachev, open this gate. Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall."

Remarks at the Brandenburg Gate
West Berlin, Germany
June 12, 1987

Posted by BurmaShave at July 23, 2007 2:04 PM

comment #23

JapAdapters says ...

Regan may have been the most sucesfull president in history in terms of serving his party's agenda. He moved the center of this country so far to the right that Bill Clinton, who was to the right of Nixon on a lot of things, became a "liberal." He was also a blight on the country. I'd love to read someone defend his stance on AIDS, Central America, cocaine, welfare, mental health services, education, labor, etc., etc., etc. Y'know, just for the laughs.

I remember when Regan got shot and being shocked that people in my neighborhood were actually dancing in the street. But that was back when poor people knew who their enemies were.

Posted by JapAdapters at July 23, 2007 2:08 PM

comment #24

BurmaShave says ...

"Behind me is a memorial that symbolizes the Ranger daggers that were thrust into the top of these cliffs. And before me are the men who put them there.

These are the boys of Pointe du Hoc. These are the men who took the cliffs. These are the champions who helped free a continent. These are the heroes who helped end a war."

Remarks at the U.S. Ranger Monument
Pointe du Hoc, France
June 6, 1984

Posted by BurmaShave at July 23, 2007 2:11 PM

comment #25

le corbeau says ...

Japter, nothing has helped poor people in the last three decades more than the defeat of inflation, thanks to the policies of Reagan and Paul Volcker. Unless it's the existence of Wal-Mart.

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 2:18 PM

comment #26

christian says ...

"Reagan's only contribution [to the subject of the MX missile] throughout the entire hour and a half was to interrupt somewhere at midpoint to tell us he'd watched a movie the night before, and he gave us the plot from WarGames, the movie. That was his only contribution."
--Lee Hamilton (Representative from Indiana) interviewed by Haynes Johnson, Sleepwalking Through History: America in the Reagan Years

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 2:21 PM

comment #27

christian says ...

"I know all the bad things that happened in that war. I was in uniform four years myself."
--President Reagan, interview with foreign journalists, April 19, 1985.

Reagan spent World War II making Army training films at Hal Roach Studios in Hollywood.

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 2:24 PM

comment #28

christian says ...

"By the end of his term, 138 Reagan administration officials had been convicted, had been indicted, or had been the subject of official investigations for official misconduct and/or criminal violations."

--Haynes Johnson, Sleepwalking Through History: America in the Reagan Years

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 2:26 PM

comment #29

christian says ...

my quotes will destroy your quotes:

"Ater taking office in 1981, the administration set out on a course to alter the (relatively) labor sensitive political economy to be more business friendly. Reagan appointed anti-union officials to the National Labor Relations Board, "implicitly [granting] employers permission to revive long shunned anti-union practices: decertifying unions, outsourcing production, and hiring permanent replacements for striking workers" (102). Reagan himself pursued such a policy when he fired eleven thousand striking air traffic controllers in 1981.

Regulations designed to protect the environment, worker safety, and consumer rights were summarily decried as unnecessary government meddling in the marketplace (Abramovitz, 1992; Barlett and Steele, 1996).

Programs designed to help the poor were also characterized as "big government," and the people who utilized such programs were often stigmatized as lazy or even criminal. With the help of both political parties, the administration drastically cut social welfare spending and the budgets of many regulatory agencies."

http://www.sociology.org/content/vol003.004/thomas.html

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 2:37 PM

comment #30

christian says ...

and mgmax, come around the streets of los angeles someday and i'll introduce you to the shambling poor souls freed by reagan when he cut the funds for mental hospitals.

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 2:39 PM

comment #31

Nate West says ...

I find Ronald Reagan personally appealing. He was very good in "The Hasty Heart." He delivered Peggy Noonan's remarks at
Pointe du Hoc beautifully. He uttered Spencer Tracy's line from State of the Union ("I paid for this microphone!") with utter conviction, as if life were a movie. When it came to distinguishing between reality and fantasy, he was not a stickler. Still, one of his fantasies--which nearly drove his aides ballastic--was the elimination of nuclear weapons. Imagine that (it's easy if you try).

If you want to know the real Reagan, skim through his recently published diaries. They're interesting only in what they do not include--anything of the slightest intellectual gravity or interest. He's a complete vacuum, a Chauncey Gardiner for real. But I still like him. I'm almost positive that, given the opportunity, Reagan could walk across the surface of a Hollywood pool.

Posted by Nate West at July 23, 2007 2:44 PM

comment #32

le corbeau says ...

For years intellectuals, journalists, political opponents, and especially academics derided Reagan as a telegenic lightweight, too simple-minded to know what containment had been about, much less to have constructive ideas about how to ensure its success. It certainly is true that Reagan relied more on instincts than on systematic study in shaping his positions. Those instincts, derived from his Midwestern upbringing, his experiences in Hollywood, and an occasional tendency to conflate movies with reality, included an unshakable belief in democracy and capitalism, an abhorrence of communism, an impatience with compromise in what he regarded as a contest between good and evil, and - very significantly - a deep fear that the Cold War might end in a nuclear holocaust, thereby confirming the Biblical prophecy of Armageddon. This was, to say the least, an unorthodox preparation for the presidency. When combined with the fact that Reagan took office as the oldest elected chief executive - he turned 70 shortly after his inauguration - it seemed reasonable to expect an amiable geriatric who would for the most part follow the lead of his own advisers.

That view turned out to be wrong on several counts. First, it overlooked the skill with which Reagan had managed his pre-presidential career: it was no small matter to have shifted the Republican Party to the right while centrist Republican presidents - Nixon and Ford - were occupying the White House.

Second, it failed to take into account Reagan's artful artlessness: his habit of appearing to know less than his critics did, of seeming to be adrift even as he proceeded quietly toward destinations he himself had chosen.

Third, and most important, it neglected what Reagan himself had said in several hundred radio scripts and speech drafts prepared between 1975 and 1980: these almost daily commentaries, composed in longhand on legal pads without the assistance of speechwriters, provided a more voluminous record of positions taken on national and international issues than had been available for any other modern presidential aspirant. They put forward no comprehensive strategy for ending the Cold War. That would emerge only gradually, in response to what happened after Reagan entered the White House. These broadcasts and speeches did, however, contain most of the ideas that lay behind that strategy - and they establish that the ideas came mostly from Reagan himself.

Reagan was, then, no lightweight. He came into office with a clear set of ideas, developed for the most part on his own, on how to salvage the strategy of containment by returning to its original objective: that of convincing Soviet leaders, as Kennan had written in 1947, "that the true glory of Russian national effort can find its expression only in peaceful and friendly association with other peoples and not in attempts to subjugate and dominate those peoples." He would do this, not by acknowledging the current Soviet regime's legitimacy, but by challenging it; not by seeking parity in the arms race but by regaining superiority; not by compromising on the issue of human rights but by capitalizing on it as a weapon more powerful than anything that existed in the military arsenals of either side. "The Reagan I observed may have been no master of detail," Soviet ambassador Dobrynin later observed, "but he had a clear sense of what he wanted."

--John Lewis Gaddis, Robert A. Lovett Professor of Military and Naval History at Yale University, speech at George Washington University, April 15, 2004

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 2:55 PM

comment #33

JapAdapters says ...

"Ronald Reagan should be executed for crimes against humanity."

--Me, Certified Nobody, rant at my girlfriend's pool, Summer 1996

Posted by JapAdapters at July 23, 2007 3:29 PM

comment #34

christian says ...

"Ronald Reagan claimed that the Russian language had no word for "freedom." (The word is "svoboda"; it's quite well attested in Russian literature.) Ronald Reagan said that intercontinental ballistic missiles (not that there are any non-ballistic missilesâ€”a corruption of language that isn't his fault) could be recalled once launched. Ronald Reagan said that he sought a "Star Wars" defense only in order to share the technology with the tyrants of the U.S.S.R. Ronald Reagan professed to be annoyed when people called it "Star Wars," even though he had ended his speech on the subject with the lame quip, "May the force be with you." Ronald Reagan used to alarm his Soviet counterparts by saying that surely they'd both unite against an invasion from Mars. Ronald Reagan used to alarm other constituencies by speaking freely about the "End Times" foreshadowed in the Bible. In the Oval Office, Ronald Reagan told Yitzhak Shamir and Simon Wiesenthal, on two separate occasions, that he himself had assisted personally at the liberation of the Nazi death camps.

There was more to Ronald Reagan than that. Reagan announced that apartheid South Africa had "stood beside us in every war we've ever fought," when the South African leadership had been on the other side in the most recent world war. Reagan allowed Alexander Haig to greenlight the Israeli invasion of Lebanon in 1982, fired him when that went too far and led to mayhem in Beirut, then ran away from Lebanon altogether when the Marine barracks were bombed, and then unbelievably accused Tip O'Neill and the Democrats of "scuttling." Reagan sold heavy weapons to the Iranian mullahs and lied about it, saying that all the weapons he hadn't sold them (and hadn't traded for hostages in any case) would, all the same, have fit on a small truck. Reagan then diverted the profits of this criminal trade to an illegal war in Nicaragua and lied unceasingly about that, too. Reagan then modestly let his underlings maintain that he was too dense to understand the connection between the two impeachable crimes. He then switched without any apparent strain to a policy of backing Saddam Hussein against Iran. (If Margaret Thatcher's intelligence services had not bugged Oliver North in London and become infuriated because all European nations were boycotting Iran at Reagan's request, we might still not know about this.)"

christopher hitchens on reagan
http://www.slate.com/id/2101842/

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 3:30 PM

comment #35

MickTravis says ...

Jap adapters???

Posted by MickTravis at July 23, 2007 4:16 PM

comment #36

le corbeau says ...

So the story is, when The Naked and the Dead was published, the publisher made him change all the instances of a common word in the soldier's vocabulary to "fug," "fugging" and "fuggers."

So Mailer, as the bright young novelist of the moment, starts going to chichi Manhattan parties, and at one of the first ones he meets the great Broadway star (and occasional movie actress) Tallulah Bankhead. He's introduced to her and she declares, in her loudest stage voice, "Oh, so you're the young man who doesn't know how to spell 'fuck'!"

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 4:57 PM

comment #37

Ogami Itto says ...

"I'd love to read someone defend his stance on AIDS, Central America, cocaine, welfare, mental health services, education, labor, etc"

Yeah. It was Reagan's hardline stance against cocaine that really pissed me off -- that fucking bastard.

Posted by Ogami Itto at July 23, 2007 5:10 PM

comment #38

Ogami Itto says ...

And porno. Why did Reagan have to ruin everyone's fun?

Posted by Ogami Itto at July 23, 2007 5:12 PM

comment #39

JapAdapters says ...

Yeah, Reagan took such a hardline stance against cocaine the CIA was shaking in their boots ... and making a gazillion dollars off of its entry into this country. But crack was like AIDS, it didn't matter until it reached the right people. Then it was an epidemic. If that's not being a fucking bastard, what is?

Posted by JapAdapters at July 23, 2007 5:19 PM

comment #40

T. S. Idiot says ...

Mick Travis: JapAdapters is an allusion to one of the greatest moments in Mean Streets. This is a film site wherein folks are expected to spot allusions, o lucky man.

Posted by T. S. Idiot at July 23, 2007 5:29 PM

comment #41

le corbeau says ...

Great, now we have two D.Z.s spouting truths, half-truths and total wackjob conspiracies indistinguishably. Hopefully Jeff will keep posting those political items on this movie site...

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 5:59 PM

comment #42

JapAdapters says ...

Mgmax, if you're referring to me please explain what "truths, half-truths and total wackjob conspiracies" you speak of.

T.S. Idiot, I think Mick Travis was actually quoting the movie.

Posted by JapAdapters at July 23, 2007 6:19 PM

comment #43

D.Z. says ...

Mgmax: "Reagan was fairly deaf and ill at ease in many social conversations situations as a result."

You'd have to be that way, in order to be able to sleep at night after funding death squads...

"Japter, nothing has helped poor people in the last three decades more than the defeat of inflation, thanks to the policies of Reagan and Paul Volcker."

Yes, things are cheaper than they were 30 years ago.

"He would do this, not by acknowledging the current Soviet regime's legitimacy, but by [supporting Bin Laden]"

"not by seeking parity in the arms race but by [selling weapons to Iran and Iraq]"

"not by compromising on the issue of human rights but by [ignoring apartheid and giving firepower to right-wing paramilitary groups which had no problems shooting nuns]"

Mathew: "Norman Mailer was criticised for his role in getting Jack Abbott released"

Yeah, and Ron got Ollie and Bush Sr. off the hook.

Posted by D.Z. at July 23, 2007 6:33 PM

comment #44

le corbeau says ...

Japters, I can't even follow your comment well enough to know precisely what you're saying, but it appears that either cocaine, crack or AIDS was a CIA plot, there were some people you either wanted it or didn't want it to reach, and Reagan somehow has personal responsibility for this because he either ordered it, or didn't order it, or made money off it, or something. I don't know and I don't care.

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 6:33 PM

comment #45

JapAdapters says ...

If you don't care then shut the fuck up. If you do, I never said Reagan "ordered" anything. Here's three facts for you to put into your neo con machine and see what answer it spits out. #1: Aids, wherever it came from, was ignored because it only effected homosexuals. This happened on Reagan's watch. #2: The CIA had a hand in crack cocaine's creation and distribution. If you can argue against this, go ahead, then go read a declassified document or 200. #3: Both AIDS and crack became a problem for the Reagan administration when they went beyond the gay and black communities respectively. This shows a distinct lack of caring about either community, as does every other policy during his presidency. Again, if you care to refute this then have at it. If all you're going to do is fall back on the flaccid 'you're like DZ' routine then continue not caring about facts, reality, of the state of man.

Posted by JapAdapters at July 23, 2007 6:43 PM

comment #46

MickTravis says ...

T.S. Idiot: "JapAdapters is an allusion to one of the greatest moments in Mean Streets. This is a film site wherein folks are expected to spot allusions, o lucky man."

You mean the scene where Richard Romanus says, "Jap adapters???" after he thought he bought a truckload of lenses? I'll have to look into that.

(p.s. you got my movie wrong. it's britannia hospital; snap)

Posted by MickTravis at July 23, 2007 8:21 PM

comment #47

christian says ...

"I don't know and I don't care."

the most truthful thing you've said yet.

and bush just hit 25 percent approval today. 75 percent of the nation now suffers bush derangement syndrome.

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 9:28 PM

comment #48

JapAdapters says ...

MickTravis, it was actually "German lenses." Clearly you know nothing.

Posted by JapAdapters at July 23, 2007 9:51 PM

comment #49

Walter Sobchak says ...

I'm often amazed at liberals' amazing ability to climb into the brains of people they haven't met and determine with pin-point accuracy the person's I.Q.

It's helpful for them when it comes to conservatives because they can then more easily place them in one of the two categories that conservatives must be confined to in the minds of liberals - "stupid" or "evil".

Ike- stupid
Nixon - evil (okay, I'll give you that one)
Ford - stupid
Cheney - evil
Dubya - stupid

Ronnie was one of those rare conservatives who confounded them by fitting into both. "He's stupid!" "No wait, he's evil!" "Wait a minute...he's stupid AND evil!"

Posted by Walter Sobchak at July 23, 2007 9:57 PM

comment #50

Walter Sobchak says ...

Ah sister christian, once again your jackassery shows. 75 percent of the nation disaproves of how Bush is handling the job of president. (not good at all by any measure) However, of that 75 percent, I'd say only about fifteen to twenty percent suffer from BDS. The rest think he's doing a poor job and would vote for someone else if now given the chance.

The BDS sufferers like yourself feel that he not only is doing a poor job, but he should be thrown in a three by four cement cell for life and his name should be expunged from all history texts and if they could, (body starts shaking, foaming at the mouth, teeth gritting) they would love to just punch that smug frat-boy face of his that stupid cowboy grin and, and, and...!!! Arrrgfgggghh!!!

Posted by Walter Sobchak at July 23, 2007 10:04 PM

comment #51

christian says ...

"I'd say only about fifteen to twenty percent suffer from BDS."

is that the figure you arrived at by climbing into their brains?

i guess you're okey doke with political corruption. funny coming from somebody who -- i'm climbing in now -- probably has no problem with doperstaggersactivistsinnocents being put away but a lying president and crooked incompetent administration are but a syndrome born of ill-placed rage. like yours.

Posted by christian at July 23, 2007 10:16 PM

comment #52

le corbeau says ...

Okay, we have three of them. Aren't we blessed.

Posted by le corbeau at July 23, 2007 10:33 PM

comment #53

D.Z. says ...

Walter: Ike was actually smart. He just didn't care about black people. Nixon was more like a sore loser. Ford was just buying time. And actually, you got it backwards: Cheney's the idiot, because he picked Bush to execute his neo-con plans. Oh, and almost 50% of the public support impeachment for Dubya.

Posted by D.Z. at July 23, 2007 11:33 PM

comment #54

Walter Sobchak says ...

Ike didn't care about black people?!

Who sent federal troops to Little Rock High School to enforce desegregation? Adlai Stevenson?

Posted by Walter Sobchak at July 23, 2007 11:41 PM

comment #55

D.Z. says ...

Walter: "Who sent federal troops to Little Rock High School to enforce desegregation?"

He only did it because of the Court ruling, not because he actually cared about desegregating the country.

Posted by D.Z. at July 24, 2007 12:31 AM

comment #56

BurmaShave says ...

Yes because as we know from our Civics classes, a court can direct the President to send federal troops somewhere.

"The've made their ruling. Now let them enforce it." - Andrew Jackson

Posted by BurmaShave at July 24, 2007 2:22 AM

comment #57

le corbeau says ...

IKE LIED, SOLDIERS DIED!

Fortunately they were German soldiers, so it was okay.

Posted by le corbeau at July 24, 2007 5:48 AM

comment #58

JapAdapters says ...

Okay, we have three of them. Aren't we blessed.

Posted by: Mgmax

Ah, once again your form of discourse underwhelms. Can't go sideways can you? Then again, what could you say?

Posted by JapAdapters at July 24, 2007 6:33 AM

comment #59

D.Z. says ...

Burma: "Yes because as we know from our Civics classes, a court can direct the President to send federal troops somewhere."

This was back when Republicans still believed in checks and balances and respecting the law.

Posted by D.Z. at July 24, 2007 8:05 AM

comment #60

George Prager says ...

"Hi, my name is (D.Z. Mgmax, Japadapters, etc.) and I'm a HE postaholic. I originally visited this website to read about and discuss movies. Now I find myself getting into pointless and time -consuming debates about Ronald Reagan, fat chicks, the Iraq War...

"After getting into a particularly heated and hateful debate about Eisenhower I blacked out. When I awoke, I was lying in an alley way with my wallet gone, my clothes torn and dirty, a broken 40 of Piels next to my head...

Posted by George Prager at July 24, 2007 11:05 AM

comment #61