comment #1

CitizenKanedforChewingGum says ...

Oh, Philly...more PSH + PTA is always a good thing.

comment #2

adamp says ...

Firstly..... drool......

Secondly; the Cruisemeister is not going to be happy. Pretty sure I've seen an interview where he proclaims to be 'friends' with PTA. And we know how much those particular religious types like to look in the mirror.....

comment #3

drbob says ...

I like to think of Scientology as Hubbard's grand practical joke to debunk all religious belief systems.

Of course, I know Hubbard was just about the Benjamins.

comment #4

DeeZee says ...

Budget's too fucking high and it'd be smarter to just adapt Stranger in a Strange Land already. Plus, they sort of already did this with Tommy.

comment #5

Punchdrunk says ...

Shut the fuck up Deezee, you're out of your element.

Whatever PTA films, Punchdrunk sees opening day.

comment #6

anonymous2 says ...

The smoke screen is probably to try and keep scientology scrutiny away from the production. The last thing they'd want is a bunch of scientologists wreaking havok.

What kind of belt?

comment #7

ElstonGunnAICN says ...

Anderson really likes that older man/younger character dynamic, doesn't he? Hope it doesn't seem tired here. Really looking forward to it, though.

comment #8

Renfield says ...

That IS just like Scientology. In order to get into their Sea Org (aka Slave Labor Club) you have to sign a 5 billion year contract.

I've been hoping for a major media take-down of Scientology...showing all of the human rights violations that go on inside under the cloak of "religion"... and can't wait for this!

However...Wells, you do realize that by giving that line away you just unleashed Scientology's lawyers and Fair Game practice on PTA, right?

comment #9

Markj74 says ...

Anything that takes down the ludicrous Scientologists automatically goes to the top of my viewing list.

comment #10

Eloi Manning says ...

It's kind of hard to imagine Scientology surviving in its current form for much longer. It's a running joke in popular culture, and its biggest star supporters - Cruise, Travolta - aren't as influential in Hollywood as they used to be. It's kind of hard to imagine younger stars being suckered in, what with all the exposes and documentaries about it since. Can you imagine, say, Chris Pine or Shia LaBoeuf eagerly joining the Hubbard ranks? It'd almost be career suicide.

comment #11

The Winchester says ...

Are there any scenes set in a pool?

comment #12

BurmaShave says ...

Winchester, unfortunately I hear one of the central tenets of Philly's religion will be bathing suits.

comment #13

adamp says ...

Eloi - Giovanni Ribisi isn't doing so bad, what with Avatar and all........ but for every Ribisi there's a Juliette Lewis, so you are probably right.

comment #14

Eloi Manning says ...

Winchester: Hopefully some sort of baptism scene. Nude.

comment #15

LFF says ...

I can't image the final film will be some sort of anti hubbard screed, any more than Boogie Nights was "about" Pornography.
I'm sure those elements are in there, but it would be disappointing if it was reducible to just anti-scientology.
Despite their efforts to broaden their reach geographically, I still think of it a something of a peculiar southern california phenomenon, and that is right in PTA's wheelhouse. Should be a fascinating film.

comment #16

Colin says ...

If you got the same screenplay as The Playlist did it's a fake.

comment #17

Matt Holmes says ...

If it's a fake script, I worry for those guys who wrote it. Who the hell has enough time on their hands to go to that kind of effort

comment #18

Steven Kar says ...

I think Will Smith might be a closeted scientologist, and if he's into it, then I expect his downfall soon.

comment #19

Jonathan Spuij says ...

Bring it on!

comment #20

Mark says ...

"Anything that takes down the ludicrous Scientologists automatically goes to the top of my viewing list."

For it to tear down anything, it'll have to be the funniest thing Anderson has ever done. Like twice as funny as Reed Rothchild trying to explain why he should get his tapes back.

Bowfinger times 5 is how you take it down. Mel Brooks was right in that comedy is way more effective than drama in making people see the light. Tina Fey is way more capable than Obermann in regards to taking down Palin.

comment #21

dinther says ...

I'm excited whenever PTA puts anything out. But this thread is something else. Let me offer a contrarian view on everyone's favorite pinata, Scientology.

I don't follow its specific tenets, but I'm not so sure that whatever Hubbard preached is any more "ludicrous" than the idea that a man can be born of a virgin, later executed and buried in a cave, and come to life three days later. Or that a wafer is transmuted into his "body" and eaten as a sacrament. But, as a Catholic, that is what I believe. I don't accept every tenet of the church, for sure, and I am offended by some of its practices and history, but yeah, that's my religion.

There is nothing rational about it, and I don't expect you to buy into it, but that's sort of the point. If it made sense, it wouldn't require a Kierkegaardian leap. We would do it as a matter of practicality. It would be tied together by some heuristic principles.

So that brings me to Scientology. It is a religion, yes? So even though its practices sounds bizarre to me, who am I - and who are you - to criticize others who adopt it? Animists in Africa do some incredibly barbaric things to their own bodies. Multiple religions practice unnecessary child circumcision. Like the Catholic church (and every other established church), some of these practices deserve criticism. Then again, absent a demonstration of coercion, the people who abide by its tenets are basically exercising their autonomy to do so. For them, the leap is made, the trade-off works.

So maybe some of the "human rights" charges stick (as they do at times with the Catholic church). And obviously, we look into those. But to criticize its core tenets, or those who buy into it... It is a religion. That's sort of the point.

comment #22

Gaydos says ...

I'm usually loathe to repeat the comment of others, but in this case I can't stop myself.

God, let this be.

Paul Thomas Anderson and Philip Seymour Hoffman doing the L. Ron Hubbard story: can I call Moviephone now for my ticket?

comment #23

ZayTonday says ...

I just drove by the big blue Scientology building on sunset and it's all bulldozed... WTF, anonymous wins??

comment #24

Gordon27 says ...

"If it's a fake script, I worry for those guys who wrote it. Who the hell has enough time on their hands to go to that kind of effort"

Somebody who'st rying to promote their script about Scientology?

comment #25

Gordon27 says ...

dinther - I really don't feel like going point by point; suffice it to say, the entire reason that Scientology calls itself a religion -- well, other than tax benefits -- is so that people will defend it along the lines you do.

"Then again, absent a demonstration of coercion, the people who abide by its tenets are basically exercising their autonomy to do so."

It is simply ludicrous to suggest that, merely because some people *do* join without heavy coercion, that they are not coercing people to join; they're blackmailers.

comment #26

dinther says ...

Gordon - you use the term "blackmail." Are you saying that people are taken against their will and forced to join the religion, on the threat that if they do not become Scientologists, information will be divulged about them that could cause them material pecuniary loss?

I'm not being snarky - It's a serious question. For if what you describe occurs, there is a legal remedy and a relatively severe criminal sanction. (As someone who practices and teaches law, I tend to take words seriously, as would any state or federal prosecutor offered the facts you describe). 501c3 status won't shield a church from this conduct.

But if what you say is true, that is beside the point I'm making. I'm not "defending" scientology. My critique was simply to point out that historically every major religion has been denigrated as a crackpot cult, on the basis that it betrays prevailing ontological structures. When people ridicule Scientology for its core tenets, it sits in pretty good company.

comment #27

Manitoba says ...

Scientology can be a bit of a wounded lion when it gets mad.I have a vague memory of a pretty impressive Time magazine cover story and expose on the "church' away back in the 1980s. The church hierarchy got so mad at Time that it ran a series of full-page attack ads in U.S.A. Today that seemed to go on forever. If my memory is correct they even dredged up the fact that Time once named Hitler as Man of the Year.Paul Thomas Anderson and Philip Seymour Hoffman could be in for quite a bumpy ride experience.But I wish them well.

comment #28

hunterd says ...

Christianity, Judaism and Islam are way more evil and have a much larger negative effect on your day to day life than Scientology could ever hope to have. People call Scientology "crazy" or "cultish" or "stupid" while practicing a religion that makes just as little sense. I mean, have you READ Revelations? It's a book about zombies fighting dragons for supremacy of the universe!

comment #29

Mgmax, le Corbeau says ...

Here's the difference between a religion and a cult. The beliefs may be just as nutty. The fat rich guys at the top may be just as venal. But somewhere, in a real religion, there is a girl who could have been somebody's wife and instead she's sweating her beauty away in the African jungle running a malaria clinic. And it's her saintly devotion and steely determination that redeems all the rest of it.

Nobody has ever done anything like that in Scientology.

comment #30

Renfield says ...

Dinther,

Yes there are many forms of blackmail going on within Scientology. Sea Org members are forced to COMPLETELY disconnect from their families if those family members are not Scientologists. There are countless video confessionals about this all over the internet. Mothers, Fathers, brothers...all trying to get their brainwashed loved ones back.

There are cases of forced abortions, beatings and even deaths at their "Gold Base" in Hemet, CA. The fences at this "base" have spikes that point INWARD. Sea Org members are not allowed to leave unless they are shipped elsewhere.

They are somehow abe to get away with this under the guise of "religion" and the fact that they pay Sea Org members 40 bucks a week for 16-18 hour work days. I've spoken to many Sea Org members and, trust me, when they're not running away when you simply say "hello", they are faaaar gone.

I've written to the L.A. D.A. many times, sending him links to confessionals by former Scientologists and have never heard a peep about it.

If you'd like to learn more, start by checking out Mark Bunker's website: www.xenutv.com

comment #31

Gordon27 says ...

"Are you saying that people are taken against their will and forced to join the religion, on the threat that if they do not become Scientologists, information will be divulged about them that could cause them material pecuniary loss?"

No, people are tricked into joining the religion and then, by the time they find out that it's (a) a religion [benefit of the doubt that it's not a cult], (b) that specific religion, and (c) a scam, it's too late, because they've got your information. All the stuff you've confessed to during cleansing, all the banking information you gave them as part of your trust exercises... they use it all against you to keep you a member of the church. This is all very heavily documented.

This is not to say that nobody who is a Scientologist is good, or that the religions you refer to haven't committed evils in their own way (possibly worse way). But their methods of operation in the current day are significantly more evil than the mainstream ones.

comment #32

BurmaShave says ...

Ronald you make a fair point, but I'd still submit the only different between a cult and a religion is a thousand years.

comment #33

GKLondon says ...

Adamp, a little late to the party, but what a great way of putting it: "...we know how much those religious types like to look in the mirror..."

Well said, Here here. Touche'.

comment #34

Mgmax, le Corbeau says ...

"Ronald you make a fair point, but I'd still submit the only different between a cult and a religion is a thousand years."

Or a hundred years and statehood for Utah.

comment #35

Noiresque says ...

My dad ran into some Anonymous protesters when he was at a conference. He got a photo taken with them, all decked out in their masks.

A former lecturer of mine at uni is a former politician, and submitted a report investigating Scientology and cult practices to parliament. He had lots of good stories. He told me once criticised Scientology during a tutorial, and was told later on that one of the students in the class was a Scientologist and complained to the university.

comment #36

dinther says ...

Gordon and Renfield - these allegations (I'm accepting what you say as true) don't seem too difficult to prove. Especially the ones relating to bank accounts and confinement against their will.

Any prosecutor worth a salt would be able to take the facts you've given - especially if "heavily documented" - and proceed to a grand jury. With respect to these allegations, that Scientology postures itself as a religion wouldn't matter one way or another.

comment #37

Renfield says ...

Then spread the word, Dinther! Because, obviously, from letters and e-mails I've sent, the D.A. just don't seem to care. From the link I provided you, there are many people who are willing to speak out and take them down.

comment #38

Gordon27 says ...

How does one prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that the final time they gave money to their religion was involuntary, unlike all the previous ones? And how does one prove in a court of law that they weren't perfectly free to go when the defense will call up dozens of people willing to lie for the church and say that they were there, the person was free to go, and anyway the person is a child molestor.

That's their other big thing; they go after their critics as hard as they can, sometimes physically, sometimes financially, often with accusations of child molestation. It takes balls to go after them in any serious way, because they will do whatever they can to shut people up.

comment #39

dinther says ...

not. sure if anyone is still following, but fwiw.

this is the problem I have with your description of events, renfield and Gordon. you don't have to prove your case in a criminal suit beyond a "shadow of doubt." only a reasonable doubt. and in a civil case it's even easier. and indictments issue on far more attenuated evidence. convictions and judgments are achieved on far less evidence as well.

if a case was "well documented" then a prosecutor - or able civil litigator - would be able to prove it. and contrary to renfields intimation, prosecutors don't shy away from big names. especially federal prosecutors. and an organization with deep pockets like Scientology? that would be a plaintiffs' bar's wet dream.

and the idea of a super conspiracy mounted by scientologists to shut up anyone who might testify against them? if anyone tried that in a federal case, they would be opening themselves up to a world of serious prison time.

so yeah, I can accept that scientologists go to extreme measures to protect the reputation of their church. but this master plan conspiracy that insulates them from prosecution? sorry. not buying it for a second.

comment #40

ativan says ...

I can't image the final film will be some sort of anti hubbard screed, any more than Boogie Nights was "about" Pornography.
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comment #41

boston terrier says ...

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