Carol Reed Is Singing

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What possible reason would Lionsgate and Studio Canal have for putting out a new Bluray of Carol Reed's The Third Man if not to appeal to those who were turned off by Criterion's grain-monk Bluray of this legendary 1949 film?

Joseph Cotten in Carol Reed's The Third Man.

I realize that the Criterion version is out of print and all, but it only emerged 18 months ago (i.e., on 12.16.08) and I'm sure it was bought or at least sampled by most of the Reed freaks out there so it's not like the market hasn't been sated. So why else would this brand new Bluray be set for September release if someone wasn't persuaded that numerous Bluray fanatics agree with my rants about Criterion's grainstorm version?

Let's hope that (a) the Lionsgate Studio Canal version is not going to be the same Criterion transfer and (b) that whoever re-masters it will use at least some restraint in finessing those hundreds of millions of sand pebbles that are currently smothering the faces and wardrobes of Orson Welles, Joseph Cotten, Alida Valli, Trevor Howard, Bernard Lee, Wilfrid Hyde-White and the rest of that post-war Vienna gang. Not to mention those old Vienna locations and that ferris wheel and all those ants on the ground.

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Posted by Jeffrey Wells on July 1, 2010 at 12:52 PM

comment #1

DrewAtHitFix says ...

It's got zero to do with grain complaints, Jeff.

The Criterion title is OOP because the rights reverted to Lionsgate/Studio Canal. They're putting out their own version since they now have those rights again, and they have their own arthouse Blu-ray label.

No one is making reissue decisions because you still don't understand film grain.

Posted by DrewAtHitFix at July 1, 2010 1:19 PM

comment #2

bluefugue says ...

Is it going to be the same transfer? At least it's nice to know I'll have another chance to pick up 3rd Man on Blu-Ray.

Posted by bluefugue at July 1, 2010 1:26 PM

comment #3

Carol Reed's Angel Erection says ...

Here's hoping they DNR the fuck out of that image! Schwing!

Posted by Carol Reed's Angel Erection at July 1, 2010 1:27 PM

comment #4

Jeffrey Wells says ...

Seriously...no heavy DNR-ing. Just some tasteful, respectful DNR-ing, that's all.

Posted by Jeffrey Wells at July 1, 2010 1:33 PM

comment #5

Colin says ...

If it looks better I might consider a purchase but if not I'll pass.

Posted by Colin at July 1, 2010 1:43 PM

comment #6

gazer says ...

Here's a little read-up on what The Digital Bits has to say about Digital Noise Reduction(DNR), prompted by the latest Fox blu-ray release/make-over of Mr. McTiernan's Predator:

http://www.thedigitalbits.com/#mytwocents

Posted by gazer at July 1, 2010 2:22 PM

comment #7

Manitoba says ...

I wonder how the hard to forget ending will look in the new Bluray? It is set in a cemetery on a gloomy day with the camera staring down a long alley of trees that flanked a straight, endless road. From far,far away Valli starts her walk toward the camera and leading man Joseph Cotten. Like the audience, Cotten is confident she would join him.B ut instead she contiues her steady pace, out of the shot and into limbo. In his autobiography "Vanity Will Get You Somewhere", Cotten says this was all Carol Reed despite studio pleas for an alternate ending.

Posted by Manitoba at July 1, 2010 3:11 PM

comment #8

bluefugue says ...

Certainly one of the great closing shots in all of cinema.

Posted by bluefugue at July 1, 2010 4:15 PM

comment #9

SpinDozer says ...

While Studio Canal releases are generally not up to Criterion standards, excessive DNR is not one of their sins...

for example, DCD Beaver on Ran:

3) It is significantly sharper with more film grain than the DNR'ed Jesnet Japanese Blu-ray.

4) The grain is inconsistent and clunky and there is some chromatic shifting going on with edges showing color traces that shouldn't be there.

Yours in Dustiness

Posted by SpinDozer at July 1, 2010 5:50 PM

comment #10

Glenn Kenny says ...

Carol Reed is dead.

It's funny, I didn't read in the announcement that Studio Canal would be remastering this in accordance with the desires of film writer Jeffrey "No heavy DNRing, just tasteful, respectful DNRing" Wells. And yes, the Studio Canal Blu-rays have been all over the place. "Contempt" is pretty great except for one utterly fucked-up shot; "Breathless," very nice (albeit a bit on the grainy side, by our host's standards), "Ran," a little blah. And of course there's its "The Ladykillers," which Wells laid into pretty harshly here, and which he obviously didn't take into account when he imagined Carol Reed singing.

And yes, Drew is absolutely right; the new release has nothing to do with anything else he imagines, motivation-wise. These flights of fancy can sometimes be charming, but a little journalism is nice sometimes too. Anybody who's been keeping abreast of the various titles going out of print could make the more sensible inference.

Posted by Glenn Kenny at July 1, 2010 7:22 PM

comment #11

Jeffrey Wells says ...

Yeah, okay...fine. Lionsgate/Studio Canal is just "releasing" a Third Man Bluray because they can -- because the rights are now theirs and because their management team said to themselves, "We're here to serve the fans, damn it, and we can't ignore the clamoring on streetcorners for yet another Third Man Bluray! We have a responsibility to do this."

Studio Canal is right to refuse to believe those who are claiming that everyone who wanted to own The Third Man in Bluray bought the recently-released Criterion disc. THEY SHOULD REFUSE TO BELIEVE THAT! They should put out a press release saying, "There are thousands of hardcore cinefans who never saw it or rented it or anything, and we are here to serve their needs. Because it's the right thing to do, and we are a company that cares about Carol Reed fans, and believes that they are legion."

I thought it interesting that neither you nor Drew McWeeny had speculations to offer about whether or not the Studio Canal Buray might be the same Criterion version (I wouldn't think so) or if they'll be remastering it. You have nothing to add to the conversation? Such as "hopefully they'll duplicate the grainstorm qualities of the Criterion because that was the way to go" or "perhaps some tasteful and respectful DNRing might be appropriate in this case"?

I was told, by the way, by a guy in a position to know that the source element[s] that Criterion used to produce its notorious Bluray may not have been the very best, and that a much cleaner and less irritating source exists.

Posted by Jeffrey Wells at July 2, 2010 7:05 AM

comment #12

Joe Gillis says ...

"I was told, by the way, by a guy in a position to know that the source element[s] that Criterion used to produce its notorious Bluray may not have been the very best, and that a much cleaner and less irritating source exists."

Are you sure it was a guy you were talking to, Wells? Are you sure it wasn't...nothing? 'Cause even if you're still trying to add credence to your anti-grain rants, you don't gain a whole lot of street cred by saying, "Somebody you don't told me I'm right." Doesn't work that way.

Since when did the identity of people in the know of film mastering source elements become hushed and proprietary? It's not like this guy's spoiling the end of Inception or sneaking a peek at the script for Spielberg's latest; if this person exists, then he's said something along the lines of "More prints were struck for the The Third Man than originally thought, and I believe there's a sparkling one in ______'s possession that would make a good Blu-ray." That's hardly damming in the eyes of Criterion or God or anyone else. Even if your mystery source were a Criterion employee, this hardly seems like the kind of situation where he'd have to meet you in a parking garage after hours to spill about The Third Man print his office neglected to use.

So spill, Wells. Who says Criterion could've used a different, cleaner print? Back up your claims with some hard facts, and maybe the vitriol against you will die down a little.

Posted by Joe Gillis at July 2, 2010 7:30 AM

comment #13

bents75 says ...

Hmmm, thanks for that Predator blu-ray link gazer. Very interesting.

I was all ready to pick that up and now it's apparent I should just get the original release instead, which I'm sure is half the price now, conveniently.

Way to come through with a link that actually has some relevance to the topic.

See how that works DZ?

Posted by bents75 at July 2, 2010 7:43 AM

comment #14

animal house says ...

"Didja read that Wells piece?"

"We blew it."

"Now let's do this transfer right!"

Posted by animal house at July 2, 2010 10:13 AM

comment #15

Jeffrey Wells says ...

Wells to Joe Gillis: Robert Harris. It was just chit-chat, but he told me once that he believes that better source materials exist. I know not precisely where. Oh, and Gillis? Take your insolent tone and shove it up your ass sideways.

Posted by Jeffrey Wells at July 2, 2010 10:27 AM

comment #16

Glenn Kenny says ...

Of course I presume that Studio Canal will be doing its own master of the film. That is why I cited the all-over-the-place quality of the previous Blu-rays from the concern; to point out that there's no real way of knowing how good the "Third Man" Blu-ray from SC is going to look. I'm already on record as being fine with the Criterion Blu-ray of "Man" and I will be interested to see if Studio Canal is able to avail itself of the superior materials of which Mr. Harris has spoken for its transfer.

Posted by Glenn Kenny at July 2, 2010 1:24 PM

comment #17

Bob Violence says ...

Clearly Lionsgate issued their own BD of Pierrot le fou to attract the millions of non-monk Godard/Belmondo/Karina fans who were turned off by Criterion's immaculate transfer and correct color timing

Posted by Bob Violence at July 2, 2010 6:55 PM

comment #18

DeeZee says ...

bents: Of course, I already mentioned that link before, so....

Posted by DeeZee at July 3, 2010 3:18 AM

comment #19

Daviddb says ...

For Carol Reed fans, "Night Train to Munich" has just been released by Criterion...wonder if there's grainstorm on that one as well.

Posted by Daviddb at July 3, 2010 6:58 AM

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