comment #1

PastePotPete says ...

Yeah The Game is what made think Fincher was actually in it for the long haul. What a fun, criminally underrated movie.

comment #2

PastePotPete says ...

That was originally in response to two seemingly deleted posts.

comment #3

Barnes78 says ...

Good, someone else noticed that. Has Fincher....banned any discussion regarding any of his films before 2000?? Is he now so hands on that even the blogs are under his watchful eye?!

comment #4

LexG says ...

I like THE GAME more than SOCIAL NETWORK, and maybe more than ZODIAC. The Game RUUUUUUULES. Not saying it's objectively a more accomplished movie, but as a ride it kicks ass, and has that grimy disreputable intensity that Seven and Fight Club had, before Fincher went Full Pakula.

comment #5

LexG says ...

I love Jodie Foster much as the next guy, and she did great work with Fincher in Panic Room, but I've always LOVED that it was Penn putting in a cameo in The Game... I don't know or care so much what the dynamic would've been with Jodie, but GODS PENN and DOUGLAS sharing the screen both smarming and sleazing it up is a gift from the Acting Godz, especially because this sketchy rich-prick bad-sheep brother is being portrayed by effortlessly slimy Penn conjuring up more fuck-up Roger Clinton magic than ever-dignified (non-Nell) Foster might have. Also because THE GAME dropped right in the same season as U-TURN, so it was like an awesome disreputable A-list B-movie double dip of Penn at his grimiest.

Now can someone break enough embargo to tell me if Rooney shows her feet in this, or do I have to go back to my Elm St DVD for that?

comment #6

Barnes78 says ...

Lex, this should answer your question in a myriad of ways......(And according to the MPAA)....

The American version of "The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo" is rated R for "brutal violent content including rape and torture, strong sexuality, graphic nudity, and language."

Meanwhile, "Shame" is rated NC-17 for "some explicit sexual content."

comment #7

Tristan Eldritch2 says ...

The Game starts out really, really real, but gradually falls to all hell before reaching its patently unsatisfactory conclusion.

comment #8

LexG says ...

What are you guys, new here? You comment after midnight PST at your own peril... Place gets spammed like a motherfucker, and The Outlaw Josey Wells gets out his big-ass machine gun blowing holes through posts both fake and legit, four at a time.

LIKE A BOSS.

Please let that OUTLAW-JOSEY WELLS thing take off, I thought of it 12 seconds ago and I'm still laughing.

comment #9

Noiresque says ...

"Salander is easily the leading fictional female empowerment figure of the 21st Century certainly to the millions of women who've read Larsson's Tattoo books"

What a horrifying thought! And certainly not to this woman.

comment #10

popeye says ...

I enjoy LexG's rants as much as the next but his response to Noiresque makes him eligible for a smack-down.

That said, nice to see the casting of Mara paid off.

comment #11

Sam Cleveland says ...

hey you know what's an incredibly fucking funny thing to say?

WENT FULL PAKULA.

and M:I IV is insane by the way, practically pure cinema from start to finish.

B Bird is wowee level talent.

comment #12

LexG says ...

"That said, nice to see the casting of Mara paid off."

YEAH unless you're KATE MARA, who's probably crying herself to sleep right now... For the zillionth time, I'm sure a lot of you have younger sisters or brothers... If they decided on a whim to move out to NYC or LA *TOMORROW* and had sold a screenplay or booked a plum acting gig by week's end, how would you feel? How would you feel being a C-lister and your flaky kid sis IS IN FINCHER AND MALICK MOVIES? It would SUCK BALLS.

Since I've always liked Kate Mara, it's kind of bullshit that all these critics are talking her up... Kate is still waiting for her "big break," and now her younger, hotter sister just stole her entire existence. HOW WOULD YOU FEEL?

comment #13

York "Budd" Durden says ...

Take another day or two off. Your rants are stale.

comment #14

LexG says ...

[Deleted for excessive rage and frothing at the mouth.]

comment #15

Ray says ...

Can this thread go down the memory hole too?

SELF-CENSORSHIP FOR LIFE!

About the movie I STILL have ZERO interest in seeing this, and I don't know why. I don't cream in my pants for Fincher like Wells does- I really do love his movies (and don't talk shit about The Game and Alien 3)- but there's not anything truly transcendent about the guy. He's very good and he has his own unique style, which makes him much better than a hack, but his best film (Fight Club) was YEARS ago.

As a general rule, frankly I don't like seeing movies based on books chicks read. My girlfriend can go see this and get all CHICKZ RULE!1! and ovulate to Daniel Craig if she wants, I'll be home watching 9 hours of Red Zone.

comment #16

va says ...

The Outlaw Josey Wells is PERFECT!

comment #17

Glenn Kenny says ...

It must be nice if the biggest trauma in your life is getting a comment on the HE thread mysteriously deleted. Attica! Attica! Attica!

comment #18

Alboone says ...

Please find it in your heart to not lump the Game in with Alien3 or Benji Button as his lesser works. If Hitchcock were alive today he would probably never take it out of his DVD player. That movie is fucking brilliant. Criminally underrated indeed.

comment #19

cyanic says ...

I can enjoy this new version in ignorant bliss since I haven't seen the original.

comment #20

coxcable says ...

Still think Benjamin Button is Fincher's most mature work... and Fight Club his most immature.

But it's true that well-executed pulp like Panic Room and The Game has always been a part of the director's act. So Dragon Tattoo not adding up to much aesthetically can't come as a real disappointment.

The problem is that the freshness of the original is still fresh in my mind. I walked out of the Let The Right One In remake last year thinking how very well done and how very unnecessary it was.

comment #21

the sordid sentinel says ...

@coxcable..Agree about Benjamin Button. I'll got to bat for that movie the rest of my life, definitely in my top 4 Fincher works.

comment #22

MAGGA says ...

Weird how every second Fincher film is a work of genius (Zodiac was my fav of the 00's, Social Network the best of this decade so far) and every other film is a load of rubbish. Not to pre-judge this one, but I somehow assumed they changed the story from the terrible original since Fincher was involved.

comment #23

Mr. F. says ...

"Is there anyone over the age of three and under 75 who doesn't know that David Fincher's The Girl With Dragon Tattoo is a remake of Niels Arden Oplev's 2009 Swedish-language film of the same title?"

I legitimately don't understand this. Why isn't it strictly the second film adaptation of the novel, that has nothing to do with "remaking" the first film? Top to bottom, the creative team, cast and crew are totally different. So why subtly diss this movie as just another Hollywood "remake"?

I was equally confused last year when people said the Coens did a remake of the 1969 movie True Grit. No -- they did a (faithful) adaptation of the novel that had NOTHING to do with the earlier movie. Let's not call it a remake.

comment #24

lazarus says ...

I guess I'm an anomaly of a Fincher fan, as Fight Club is my favorite of his for its daring visuals and hilarious multilevel satire, followed by Benjamin Button which moved me immensely and was a different kind of visual feast. I'm also a big fan of The Game and I think that, high concept aside, it's also one of the more perceptive films about mid-life crises and the internal atrophy of the old money-wealthy. And of course Zodiac's relentless obsession.

The Social Network is a perfectly-executed work but I don't see much of Fincher's soul in the work like with the ones mentioned above. It's just an Aaron Sorkin film that manages to be as fun to watch as it is to listen to.

comment #25

YND says ...

I wouldn't say every other film's "rubbish" by any means, but Fincher does have a pretty stealthy version of the one-for-me/one-for-them thing going on. It's not as noticeable with him as it is with some directors because his great works tend to have a high degree of Hollywood entertainment value (big stars working in popular genres) and his "off" pictures are still pretty impressive on every technical front.

Still, I'm excited for DRAGON TATTOO and am feeling like it was a really good idea to skip the book and the Swedish film. If you only need to experience one version of this material, I'm glad I waited for Fincher's.

comment #26

Gabe@ThePlaylist says ...

This is the best "Dragon Tattoo" film yet, by which I mean I didn't want to tear out my fucking fingernails. Fincher is a natural storyteller and (sorta asshole) provocateur, so he really knows how to wring the sizzle from the steak. So I mostly went with it, but holy shit, just endless death, degradation, death, death, death, degradation, death, death, death. Fincher's got more settings. I'd like to see him use them.

Like, for example, the year's fucking BEST opening credits. There's the same opening as the original, with Vanger getting the phone call, it's another delivery. And normally finicky Fincher, who's usually like LOOK AT ALL THE BOOKS HE OWNS and LOOK AT THAT TRAIN PASS ALL GLOOMY LIKE, is pretty much, Okay, let's get this over with.

And then the MIND-FUCKING CGI Tetsuo: The Iron Man freakout opening credits set to that "Immigrant Song" cover. This dude and chick made of BLACK LIQUID, emerging from computer wires, fucking like jackrabbits, then punching each other in the liquid FACE until they EXPLODE. I remember distinctly thinking, WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS? I honestly thought Fincher was in it to make this shit different and iconic at that moment.

And then... it's just the original movie again. Shinier, sexier, a little dumber (a real LOL at our serial killer pumping ENYA), but pretty much a straight genre exercise. It's just an upgraded version of the sort of thing that fell out of "Seven"'s butthole in the late nineties, and I'm stunned it would be from the guy behind "Seven."

I love Fincher as a person. I love his attitude of "No, we have to get this shot," and "No, this needs to cost $100 million" no matter what. And I love his decision to trump Lord of the Rings in a way where it feels like I Can Have More Endings Than You. Kudos to the writing team, who also found a way to improve the ending so that, hey, it actually sorta makes sense.

Otherwise, I HATE myself for the fact that I've now spent like eleven hours in Lisbeth Salander's world. Mind you, after all this time, Mikhail Blomkvist is still a boring jackoff.

comment #27

Edward Havens says ...

Even if the original Dragon Tattoo made $100m in worldwide box office, that's still about 6,969,999,999 people on the planet who didn't see it, for whatever reason. Don't like subtitles. Didn't come to a theatre near them. Came and went in a week. Don't want to watch it on Netflix Watch It Now. Whatever. And that's why you make an American version of a Swedish novel that was already made in to a Swedish movie.

As for Kate Mara... hot chicks in Hollywood are a dime a dozen. Rooney's pretty but can become more of a chameleon than Kate, and that's why Rooney will have a better career than Kate.

comment #28

bobbyperu says ...

Let's not feel too sorry for Kate. She's been in two recent Best Picture nominees, Brokeback Mountain and 127 Hours...

comment #29

Gabe@ThePlaylist says ...

Mara got the same bump for showing up in those movies that Tony Danza got for being in CRASH.

comment #30

lazarus says ...

The notion of Fincher doing "one for him, one for them" doesn't hold a lot of water, especially if we're referring to The Social Network as the former and Dragon Tattoo the latter. Didn't the director himself go on record himself last year saying something along the lines of TSN being not much more than an exercise, with Sorkin's script being the driving force?

I think it's pretty clear that Fight Club, Zodiac, and Benjamin Button are films where Fincher is significantly more invested in what's going on thematically and trying to put some of his distinct viewpoint into the mix.

Dragon Tattoo may be an exercise of a different sort, but from what I know of the source material (as well as having seen the original film trilogy), there's a lot to chew on in terms of what the story says about the corruption of European patriarchal society and its attitudes towards women. Sasha Stone's well-written review suggests that Fincher is doing anything but going through the motions on this one.

comment #31

Eloi Wrath says ...

Fincher's 'one for them, one for him' is pretty much accurate when you look down his list:

Them: Alien 3
Him: Seven
Them: The Game
Him: Fight Club
Them: Panic Room
Him: Zodiac
Them: Benjamin Button
Him: The Social Network
Them: Dragon Tattoo

comment #32

French Ant says ...

In which timeline was this remake necessary ?

God I miss the Fincher from the Seven/Game/Fight Club days.

comment #33

lazarus says ...

Eloi: you're flat-out wrong. I will look up the interview I read, but TSN was not a passion project or a personal one. And anyone who read interviews around the time of Benjamin Button or watched the documentary/listened to his commetary would know that project meant more to him.

comment #34

Eloi Wrath says ...

lazarus: Alright - maybe "one for them, one for him" is too simplistic. But he certainly seems to divide them up between more broadly commercial films and riskier ones. Whether TSN was a passion project or not, it was definitely a riskier bet at the box office than a sweeping romance starring Brad Pitt, from the writer of Forrest Gump.

I guess "commercial/non-commercial" would be a better way of putting it. You'd imagine studios would see them like this:

Alien 3 = franchise film, no brainer
Seven = dark, grim, existential thriller
The Game = more plot/style-based thriller
Fight Club = weird anarchic oddity
Panic Room = straight-up thriller
Zodiac = serial-killer procedural with no resolution
Benjamin Button = epic romance
The Social Network = biopic/courtroom drama about intellectual property rights
Dragon Tattoo = franchise film, no-brainer

comment #35

LexG says ...

"...there's a lot to chew on in terms of what the story says about the corruption of European patriarchal society and its attitudes towards women."

Strokeoff emoticon. Please. I'm all excited about it too because Fincher's great, but it's junky source material and I'm sure you could just as handily argue the feminist-flip of that bullshit, which is that it's practically Japanese-anime-level juvenile in terms of some horndog author and lecherous director(s) making this story of a pierced bisexual motorcycle-driving dildo-raping hacker badass who's about as contrived as Marion Cobretti if he had the sex life of a porn vixen and looked like a hot Goth girl.

And I know she's H-E royalty and I'll tread carefully here, but we all pretty know relying on Sasha Stone for a Fincher opinion is about as well-balanced and nuanced as me talking about Kristen Stewart. Sash probably has a poster of doughy Fincher in his bad toupee taped up to the ceiling of her bed with a shrine and lit candles over on the bureau. This is that part of the year where she goes FULL ASHLEY JUDD IN BUG psycho like a wild animal gnawing at carcass meat until the day after the Oscars end... If Fincher's name were arbitrarily slapped onto KILLER ELITE but it were the exact same movie, she and Jeff would be chanting like Name of the Rose monks to offer their very souls up to its eternal greatness.

Also can Fincher ease up on the BROWN? Is there a more BORING COLOR to have as the sheen-basis for a movie? BROWN. It's so WOOD PANELED and BORING looking. Why doesn't he shoot with more POPPING PRIMARY COLORS like Bay or somebody?

comment #36

Eloi Wrath says ...

But further to that point: it's great that with Fincher there's never really an discernable drop-off in quality between his commercial and non-commercial films. He's obviously a filmmaker who enjoys both kinds, so it's not like when you see him taking on Dragon Tattoo you're disappointed. You're always interested in what he can do with any material. You get the sense he'd throw himself fully into adapting Operation, the board game, if he was asked.

comment #37

AnnaZed says ...

I'm not sure that I entirely get the love for the Danish (not Swedish, though in Swedish language) versions of this story. They were good enough and satisfied the something-anything need of fans who had just blazed through the best-selling books. Noomi Rapace was just great, but she was also 30 years old when she made the film, and it showed (Lisbeth is in her early 20s in the book). The production values were so-so to appalling. In the second two installments especially the made-for-TV values really showed.

With a hundred million worldwide gross for the Danish film (what is that in tickets? I don't know ~ say divide by ten for ticket price, that's around 10 million people seeing the move ~ very roughly) and 30 million copies of the book sold; there are at least 20 million fans of the book who didn't bother to even see it. These fans and people who haven't read the books (millions upon millions of film-goers don't read books at all) will in fact be better served by a beautifully produced, Fincher directed film with a terrific central performance and a male lead who is more credible as the irresistible chick-magnet that Mikael Blomkvist was written to be. I haven't even seen it yet and I know that it's not a 're-make'; it's an upgrade.

comment #38

Rashad says ...

If this is anything like pre-millennium Fincher, sign me up. Outside of Zodiac I don't really care for the others.

And Fincher made this movie because it intrigued him to make a franchise for adults. His words verbatim.

comment #39

Cadavra says ...

I think the problem here is not that it's been remade but that it's been remade TOO SOON. Most people saw the original within the last year (via VOD, DVD or cable), and quite a few may not be in such a hurry to shell out $14 to see essentially the same film with different actors. Please note that LET ME IN, despite a number of reviews declaring it superior to the original, also tanked for what I believe is the same reason. (Let's not even get into DEATH AT A FUNERAL.)

comment #40

Rashad says ...

Let Me In didn't tank because of the original. It tanked simply because of the nature of the story. Dragon Tattoo will make its money.

comment #41

Cadavra says ...

"The nature of the story?" It's the one teen vampire movie that didn't make money!

comment #42

The Thing says ...

"Is there anyone over the age of three and under 75 who doesn't know that David Fincher's The Girl With Dragon Tattoo is a remake of Niels Arden Oplev's 2009 Swedish-language film of the same title?"

Surprisingly, yes, to those outside of hardcore film circles. People know the books, not the movies. Now that reviews and news are coming in, people are realizing there are older movies, but I'd say 98% people don't know