comment #1

Rashad says ...

I don't even buy Santorum is the choice of social right wingers. (I won't dignify them with the term "conservative.") This guy is a complete loon. I hate Obama but I would vote for him over Santorum in a second, and I'm not even planning on voting at all. Santorum wants to regulate everyone's bedroom. He hates the idea of sex for pleasure, and says Satan is at war with America. He's the Christian Taliban.

comment #2

Super Soul says ...

Santorum should get the nomination. We need to bring that boil to the surface so it can be lanced.

comment #3

Super Soul says ...

"should" ≠ prediction.

comment #4

reverent and free says ...

If Santorum pulls the rug out from under Romney on Super Tuesday, then it'll be brokered convention time. I do think they will start coming home to Romney though.

comment #5

Roger Sweets (gnosis) says ...

Where's Walken when you need him?
Santorum would definitely use the baby.

comment #6

62Lincoln says ...

It's amazing to watch the lunatic fringe of the Republican Party take the party down the toilet.

comment #7

Edward Havens says ...

The difference between Santorum, who will be out of the race before California's primary, and Goldwater is that Goldwater's ideals still hold true to many true-blood conservatives. Those who understand religion has no place in politics and don't like to be pandered to.

That being said, the GOP right now needs idiots like Santorum to be the front runner, so Obama can destroy him in the general election and the true-blood conservatives can get the religious wackos out of the party. "Your holy war didn't work, yet again. It's time to go back to true conservative values, free of religious dogma."

comment #8

SpinDozer says ...

Ross Douthat is an asshat. If Mitt stages a comeback and wins the nomination, it will be a harbinger for good times down the road for pro-lifers. Cos that's the way he rolls.

comment #9

Ray says ...

"The difference between Santorum, who will be out of the race before California's primary, and Goldwater is that Goldwater's ideals still hold true to many true-blood conservatives. Those who understand religion has no place in politics and don't like to be pandered to."

HOLY SHIT, when it comes to politics no one knows ANYTHING that happened more than five years ago in this country.

Goldwater was a social conservative, too. You can read his own words for yourself.

http://www.claremont.org/publications/crb/id.1237/article_detail.asp

After Goldwater died, liberals and the Left forgot that, preferring to claim Goldwater for themselves, ignoring where he WASN'T on their side.

Same shit happened to Reagan.

MARK MY WORDS, same shit will happen with George W. Bush one day.

What Santorum is saying strikes many- including quite a few Republicans- as incongruous to a moment dominated by ECONOMIC arguments.

But to say that Santorum is saying things far different than what other Republicans have said- and some have even believed!- over the years is UTTER REVISIONIST BULLSHIT.

comment #10

Edward Havens says ...

Ray, you do realize that morality and religion are not the same? One can be moral without being religious.

And I am wondering if you actually read all of the link you provided. Of all the quotes they provided from Goldwater, they clearly show a man who spoke about religion and morality, and of morality more than religion.

comment #11

AnnaZed says ...

The reason that this is even being discussed is that only and exclusively are the clown-shoes candidates being fielded in this race.

Cooler heads on the GOP side will not go up against President Obama (this in spite of his various failings); they will wait until the next election because the President is unbeatable now. This was true in the last election as well. Intelligent Republicans (not fanatics, but professionals) who are playing the long game knew this the minute that President Obama vanquished Hillary Clinton in the primaries.

Dan Savage has made certain that Santorum is unelectable (and for this I thank him) and Mitt Romney is a Mormon ~ not just a Mormon but at one time a Mormon missionary. The hatred that exists for Mormon zeal in the hinterlands is palpable. Most Christians, and this is a predominantly Christian country and the Republican party is an even more predominantly Christian subset of the population, view The Church of the Later Day Saints (quite rightly as it happens) as a bizarre religious cult; they will stay home rather than vote for him.

comment #12

AnnaZed says ...

And that's not to even mention the dog thing, which is a far bigger deal than many realize.

comment #13

Edward Havens says ...

And I am also wondering if you noticed Goldwater warned about the religious right overtaking the Republican Party, before it happened? He warned of the religious zealotry we now see with Santorum and Gingrich. If Santorum wants to be against abortion, that's fine for him. But it doesn't matter if he is a private citizen or a Congressman or a Senator or even President. No one has the right to dictate to my wife or my mother or any other woman in my family or any other family besides his own how they function. That's the biggest problem with the modern Republican Party. Allowing themselves to be co-opted by a bunch of zealots who think they are moral but in truth come from areas with higher murder rates and drug use and alcoholism and divorce and other social issues than liberal areas.

comment #14

Edward Havens says ...

Ray also seems to ignore the fact that the person most responsible for any Barry Goldwater revisionism is Barry Goldwater himself. Goldwater changed his viewpoints as he grew older, as he came to realize through personal relationships that his views maybe didn't quite mesh with the real world as it was.His views on abortion changed because of his contact with his wife, who started Planned Parenthood of Arizona. His views on homosexuality changed because of Goldwater family members who came out as gay. Goldwater progressed as a human being as he learned more about the world, something guys like Santorum seem unable to do. Would Santorum's views on abortion and when a h change if he knew more about totipotency and cell division

comment #15

Edward Havens says ...

Ray also seems to ignore the fact that the person most responsible for any Barry Goldwater revisionism is Barry Goldwater himself. Goldwater changed his viewpoints as he grew older, as he came to realize through personal relationships that his views maybe didn't quite mesh with the real world as it was.His views on abortion changed because of his contact with his wife, who started Planned Parenthood of Arizona. His views on homosexuality changed because of Goldwater family members who came out as gay. Goldwater progressed as a human being as he learned more about the world, something guys like Santorum seem unable to do. Would Santorum's views on when life begins in the womb change if he knew more about totipotency and cell division? Would his views on abortion change if his daughter got an abortion? I don't think so, and that's a major difference between the likes of Goldwater and the likes of Santorum.

comment #16

THE MovieBob says ...

The thing is, The GOP isn't REALLY as "split" on this stuff as it sometimes seems. Social-conservatism doesn't fit with The Right's professed ideal of anti-nanny-state "rugged individualism;" but the actual percentage of the "movement" - especially at the power-brokering level - that buys into it is tiny, and most of THEM are younger people and loner types.

By and large, it's a movement chiefly of old white moneyed men (and those whose fortunes are tied in with the same) who prize economic liberty (re: "The Free Market") above all else because it's best for their business interests; and whether or not they "believe" in social-con ideals they SUPPORT them as policy because it's also good for business: enforcing "live clean, marry young, move to burbs, pump out brats" as the ONE "good" standard of living is tailor-made to produce a booming population of prefab consumers; while social-liberalism doesn't, at least not quite as effectively.

It's also the case that even the ones who DO subscribe to some malformed version of Objectivism/Libertarianism only really see it in their own terms: The "Cowboy" ideal - emphasis on BOY: They're all about the INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM!!! of adult white men to drive whatever car they want, build whatever size house they want, shoot whatever animal they want, etc... but that same freedom can't POSSIBLY be extended to, say, WOMEN. Absurd! If women had the same level of Individual Freedom they did, who would stay at home and keep up the house so they'll have TIME to go live the Cowboy Ideal!? If women were as free to not have children as men are, who will pump out the kids needed to replenish my menial-labor staff and consumer base!?

comment #17

Krillian says ...

Romney's been vetted to death and the best they can come up with is the dog story. (Demonizing Mormons will get you far in some places, but I do believe more than 50% of the US resists bigotry when they can.)

Santorum's getting vetted now and that's why he's dropping. (So now even Protestants aren't Christians, huh, Rick?) Tonight's debate will shape the news for the next couple days, but the majority of the GOP came to their collective senses about Newt, and it's happening with Santorum.

Obama may look "unbeatable" now, but GHW Bush looked unbeatable in 1991 and we know how that turned out.

I guess Travis was banned again? Seems like he would've shown up by now.

comment #18

BobbyLupo says ...

"but I do believe more than 50% of the US resists bigotry when they can."

This is probably true but it's a bit late in the game for a Republican candidate to depend on them voting Republican.

comment #19

dogcatcher says ...

I don't think Obama is unbeatable, but I think the Republicans are doing all they can to give away the election to him.

comment #20

Jack Razor says ...

There's no question the left lead by CNN would reduce Santorum to meat. And I think at the end of the day all the GOP is really about is money, they may use religion and morals to get votes but at the end of the day it's all about corporations and pleasing the money men. If they think Santorum is too much of a cookoo they may be more at ease with Obama.

comment #21

austin111 says ...

I await the day when some Republican asshole finally says it the way they really want to say it: "Stone women who have abortions. That'll teach 'em." The country has now almost reached rock bottom in politics with this continuous disaster known as The Republican Party. Grand it definitely ain't anymore. I'd be more amused if I wasn't just as appalled watching each one of these men trying to one up the other in the far right department (aka pandering). It's a pathetic kind of theater that seems bent on eating it's own. I'm not sure I've ever seen such a spectacle in my lifetime and I've seen quite a lot. In this show Obama takes a back seat, because if any of these men take the White House, we have seen the last vestiges of a decent America. Truly. For gone will be any restrictions on murdering the environment, destroying a potable water supply, allowing us to think we have even the shadow of breathable air, or preserving anything beautiful (well, unless it is the well kept mansions of the very rich). Be afraid, be very afraid.

comment #22

JBM... says ...

DOOMSDAY COMETH...SATAN HAS SET HIS SIGHTS ON AMERICANS...BEEEEEEWARE...

...this goof's nothing more than an empty huckster, selling tonic town-to-town from under a tent.

comment #23

dogcatcher says ...

austin,

When the F has any Republican advocated stoning as a punishment for ANY crime? Stop being stupid Austin. There are some Republican wackadoos, true, but It would be nice if Democrats and liberals actually listened to what some conservatives had to say about things instead of distorting their beliefs and then mocking them without ever understanding what they support at all. Believe it or not, it might actually make you a better person in the end.

Austin, you are every bit as close minded and willfully ignorant as the very Republican (or the caricature of such) that you say you despise. Just keep that in mind.

comment #24

SpinDozer says ...

Dogcatcher, you are every bit as close minded and willfully ignorant as the very Democrat and Liberal (or the caricature of such) that you say you despise. Just keep that in mind.